how not to install a transducer...got a few pictures here...
first...
a thru hull transducer,it needs a fairing block,the block is a two fold,first,it allows the 'ducer to be mounted correctly into the hull.by this i mean it will read straight down,rather than off to the side-due to the "v" of a hull...second,it makes a sealing surface for the 'ducer.the 'ducer needs the block to have a good sealing surfce,without the block,most 'ducers have a very tiny area to seal the hull.
use the blue composite blocks,avoid using wood.i cut the block,after i find the correct angle,using a table saw.again,i don't reccomend wood...after you drilled the hole in the boat,remove the bottom paint in the area where the block will rest,rough up the gel coat too.by doing this,you will assure a good adhesion for the 5200.remember,nothing sticks to bottom paint,so remove it...
sealers...i use and reccomend only one sealer,3m 5200,do not believe what other's tell you,it's removable,it's not as permanent as some will tell you-i've removed and reinstalled numerous items set in 5200...do not use a silicone sealer ever !!!

here's a thru hull 'ducer installed by the owner...i removed this using no tools !!! i grabbed the 'ducer and twisted it out of the boat-i kid you not !!!
the owner purchased a raymarine "c" series unit and i was installing it,the reason the remove the 'ducer...the 'ducer was also turned slightly,as you see in the pictures,this is exactly how it appeared when i pulled the boat...scary thought huh ?




here's the fairing block this gentleman made,it was only on the inside of the hull...




this is the ducer...not the small sealing area...





look close at the pic,you can see the marks where i twisted the ducer around to unscrew it...

let's add to this shall we...

this is a transom mounted ducer...the owner of this boat ran the cable himself...this is what the cable looked like...
i replaced his fishfinder with a new one...he claimed the old one didn't work correctly...wonder why ?




this is what the ducer cable looked like when i removed it...nice huh

here's the finished product...


before...








after...

the idea of putting this up isn't to make fun of someone,or to show how smart i think i am...the idea is to keep someone from doing the same thing as these guys...it's showing yoou the correct way and why that way is correct...

Jawz, for myself I find your posts and writing to be very informative. If not only this thread others as well. I always learn something from you, whether I need it now or something to look back on or for future referances. Keep it up.
Joe

Jawz, this is good stuff

That is great. At the time I was installing my electronics I did not know much about them really but right in the structions...assuming you read them...it said DO NOT CUT OR SPLICE the transducer cable.

I do have to admit though...the only place I have ever soldered a wire together was to extend the NMEA wires to connect VFH, GPS and sonar together. This was after many conversations and I could not find anyone who did crimp them due to them being 20 or 22 AWG wires.

re: "crimp them due to them being 20 or 22 AWG wires."

Crimps for 20 and 22 AWG wires are readily available, but not in many marine supply stores. It's pretty much an electronics wholesale item (or maybe Radio Shack...seems they have less and less "useful stuff" these days"). What I don't think you will find, although I've not done an exhaustive search, is the splicers with the built-in heat shrink sleeves at 22AWG.

After many years of using a soldering iron on a very regular basis in my work, I usually solder everything and don't use crimp splicers, ever. I cover all soldered splices with heat shrink tubing and have never had one fail even after many years in a marine environment.

I've found that the biggest problem folks have with soldering electonics is trying to use a cheap and/or underpowered iron for the job at hand and the wrong solder/flux.

it's not reccomended for the marine environment,to solder any connections...solder can and will fail due to the vibration subjected to the joint in the marine environment...i recall an installation,done by a customer,the gentleman gave up trying to find the problem with the set-it was a raymarine "c 120".the problem was,the set would lose a signal from the gps antenna,i looked at the set,ran a few tests and removed the split loom protecting case around the wiring.i discovered the gentleman soldered the connections-not good ! i redid all the connections,problem solved...the owner asked what i found,i explained to him,about the soldering and how it can and will break,which is what occured,his reply was"i've soldered connections on everything,i was told that was the correct way,and that was what i was taught"...also,a much better way of "splicing" small diameter wire such as that-is the use of a junction block...wires that small are usually used for interfacing,read that as feeding different electronics information,it's much easier to use a small loop connector on a junction block...connectors for those size wires are readily available,just not to the masses,the big name boating supply stores don't normally have the correct size crimp connectors,if they do have them,i don't believe they will be "tinned",meaning,they're not really for marine use,such as the ones radio shack carries...
cutting a transducer cable,like the one i showed,isn't really reccomended at any time !! the gentleman who owned that boat,made the claim he couldn't get the connector to pass through the rigging tube ? the reason for cutting the cable...not sure why,it's a mako boat with a very large rigging tube,i had absolutley no problem...
like i stated,i've seen some big problems with some installations...it allways makes me say "what could you possibly be thinking"??? for more examples check the other thread "a real dual battery system"...

RE: soldering connections in a marine environment...
True, it's not for the average "I just bought this iron at Radio Shack for $4.95 handyperson or mechanic" HOWEVER... soldered connections fail under vibration when unsupported, i.e. at the transition from the soldered to the unsoldered wire. Using the proper heat shrink tubing and not applying excessive heat (which encourages the solder to wick up well into the wire and beyond the support of the heat shrink will result in long life connection(s)... also using crimp-on terminlas that do not have an "insulation support" (which usually requires a seperate crimp action unless one has the expensive professional tool) can also result in failure of the connection as well as failing to crimp the "insulation support" (the usual case). I had more than one wire at a crimp-on connection on a used boat I once purchased that had failed at the terminal (improperly crimped insulation support). That was the same boat that I did a solder splice with heat shrink tubing in 1979 that was still sound when I sold that boat in 1995. Normally I avoid splices at all costs unless one has the problem of no clearance for connectors in a cable run as mentioned.

Connections get soldered all the time in military electronics, even for the US Navy and they don't fail... at least not just because they were soldered. It's a matter of technique and workmanship.

bottom line is,soldering a connection is not reccomended in the marine industry...
and true,crimps are often done poorly as well...my favorite saying is "you should need a license to purchase tools"...using non marine grade wire and non tinned conncections is not reccomended either...

Most DIY and less than knowledgable mechanics use the el cheapo plier style crimp tool that comes in the "kit". It is almost impossible to get sufficient force on those handels to get the pressure that the whole crimp-on technology is based on. In order to get those crimps to really work, one needs a controlled cycle crimper that features a guaranteed crimp pressure before release. These crimpers always feature a compound action like a bolt cutter.

Neither crimp-on connectors nor soldering (or any other work on a boat that impacts safety) should be done by anyone "working above their pay grade".

this is why i allways state "you should need a liscence to purchase tools"...and again,soldering a connection is not reccomended for the marine industry...

I feel that Jawz is very generous and provides the readers here very valuable information. He should be commended.

The sharing of his knowledge gives us professional advice that serves us well. Thanks.

thanks !

if i can help someone out,just ask...you're allways welcomed to call too...

good stuff. i enjoyed reading it. I invested in good crimpers and heat tubing equip for my projects. a couple wraps of the tape they sell at the boat show has also proven to be good for keeping the wires together.

When I received my Polar 27 WA in Sept, the Raymarine c120 and yamaha gauges were not wired correctly. I took apart the connections my self to get GPS data back into the yamaha gauges. The Polar connections were excellent and I replaced with crimping, heat shrink tubbing, and some tape.

Great info here Jawz, love reading your posts with this kinda stuff. Like Retriever, although I know solder is not recommended for marine applications, I tend to solder everything, I just have a hard time trusting crimps, so far I've had very few if any problems. Maybe its time to rethink my wiring techniques.

you need to purchase a real crimper,not the $5 style...you need a good ratchet style-these are not cheap...it's like battery terminal tools,my crimpers were in the area of $400,these have the dies to properly crimp all the terminals,most people do not have this style.
soldering,as i've stated previous,is not an accepted method of making connections in the marine environment.

remember all this when a guy who works out of his truck pulls up to work on your boat....

I had the yard install a transducer on my vessel. I'm not sure it was done correctly.

don't see a transducer in this picture ???

Jawz, I think its a transom mount ducer in the lower right corner of the picture mounted from under the boat???

Now that you mention it, id does look like a transom mount, mounted upside down.

We just installed an Airmar tilted element in my buddies Albemarle yesterday replacing one that sort of looked like jawz's example above. The wood fairing block was quite rotted but still took some persuasion to remove the old one. Once removed the stem was bend about 1/2" off center...probably a good idea it was being replaced. Now the fun begins snaking the wire up to the bridge.

i have 2 transom tranducers and i have tryed every angle up and down and still lose the signal after the boat gets up on plane ,any ideas?. o only use one at a time.dont think you can use two df at the same time ? one is a raymarine dsx,the other is garmines new one.I do have a photo of the stern ,i will try to post

Here's what I did... Someone else tried it and liked it and posted to Wikia..

http://www.marine-engines.wikia.com/wiki/Fierro%27s_in-hull_guide


I have a picture avail if anyone is interested... This will be my 4th season... no problems. It's a Humminbird Matrix Dual beam.

still don't see a 'ducer in that photo...sorry...inboard powered boats can not use a transom mounted 'ducer,the signal will be lost as soon as the boat starts moving-prop wash will cause this...

as far as losing a signal is concerned on a transom mounted 'ducer,it's usually an installation problem-i've lost count of the 'ducers i've installed,never had a problem with a transom mount losing signal-ever...
post up a pic of the back end of the boat...


couldn't follow that link there bob...wanna try again ?

I run two transom mount ducers both at the same time. one garmin, one furuno...no problems at any speed upto 35 knots.

jawz, the transducer is located on the transom just above the concrete blocks supporting hull. It is mounted vertically on transom.

this is when people think i'm rude...but...here goes...

you're kidding me,right ? exactly why would anyone put a transducer there ? that rig,looks like a old school pacemaker wahoo,yes ?

Jawz...

Try a copy and past of the link into the address bar in your internet browser.